Difference between revisions of "Seasons"

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Though the developers often discussed Diablo 3 ladders (for PvP and PvE) during Diablo 3's development, there were no such character ranking systems when the game launched, and none were added in patches.  Ladders are a common fan request, either for the fun of ladder seasons/resets, or to mark different character types, such as [[Ironborn]], and Blizzard has strongly hinted that ladders are being worked on for inclusion in the Diablo 3 Expansion, or further down the line.
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'''Ladders''' rank the position of players based on set metrics such as kill score and/or character level and they usually run for a period of time (season) after which time the ladder is reset.
  
[[Paragon]] levels and the [[Achievements]] provide something of comparative player or account ranking, though there is no way to view global rankings of any such features on Battle.net. Third party sites such as [http://Diablo3Ladders.com Diablo3Ladders.com] offer ways for participating players to rank their characters by kill score or by all in-game values such as DPS, EHP, etc, sorted by class and many other variables.
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Ladders and seasons have been confirmed by Blizzard to be coming to Reaper of Souls. <ref>[http://diablo.incgamers.com/blog/comments/diablo-3-season-ladders-confirmed-coming-soon Ladders coming to Diablo 3] - Josh Mosqueira, Blizzard Entertainment, 25/04/2014</ref>
  
 +
<blue>... we’re still working on them, but the general gist is that you’ll be able to level up a character, we will have specific ladders for seasons, and also some goodies that will drop along the way. There’s more information of that to come, and we’re not making an announcement of when, but for sure Seasons are coming to Reaper of Souls. Yeah, the secret is out.</blue>
  
==Experience Ladders in Diablo III==
 
  
During development players often requested top level ranking ladders, as we saw in Diablo II. Rankings for PvP were much-anticipated as well. Neither came true, and in retrospect blue comments on the issue show the lack of enthusiasm for those features.[http://diablo.incgamers.com/blog/comments/more-on-d3s-end-game-and-achievements]
+
==Details So Far Confirmed==
  
<blue>As far as the e-peen meter goes for showing off a higher level character, we think a proper achievement system is much better at this. There’s more variety, they’re more interesting and compelling for people to work toward. One important point of note is that our achievements are cross-character, meaning we can give achievements for things like leveling 5, 10... hell, 20 characters to 60. Certainly a bigger feat than a level 99, and we can give tangible rewards for it too.</blue>
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In an interview in April 2014 [[John Hight]] fleshed out more of the details of how Ladders and Seasons were shaping up during development. <ref>[http://www.shacknews.com/article/84210/diablo-3-dev-team-discusses-reaper-of-souls-and-answers Details of Seasons] Shacknews interview with John Hight, 24/04/2014</ref>
  
Achievements do exist along those lines, but they do not satisfy the desire of many players for a more robust and global ranking, since they can only be viewed one account at a time, rather than on some huge leaderboard.
 
  
 +
*Each Season begins with a fresh characters
 +
*No access to existing stash, loot or shards
 +
*When season ends all experience, items, gold etc is rolled back into your normal non-ladder roster
 +
*New, powerful legendaries that drop only to ladder characters
 +
*Leaderboards will rank progress by various metrics such as region, clans
  
==Ladders Coming in D3X?==
 
  
Travis Day spoke about future plans for Diablo 3 ladders during a live stream in May 2013. [http://diablo.incgamers.com/blog/comments/travis-day-diablo-3-interview-live-stream]
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<blue>Seasons are a shard of the existing game where everything is a fresh start. You start with a brand new character without access to any of the gold or items you collected with your primary account for the length of the season. We plan on creating brand new, powerful legendaries that only drop within in the season. After the season ends, all of your progress — your experience, your items, your gold, etc. — will be rolled into the main roster. The goal is the fresh-start feeling — so many changes and tweaks have happened since the launch of Diablo III — it is really energizing and fun to recreate that ‘first-moment-in-a-new-game’ feeling.
  
<blue><font color="#FFFFFF">Will there ever be a ladder?</font><br>
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We’ve also added leaderboards. Players can race on a variety of metrics to try to become the leader in their region or the top of their friends and clan lists. That friendly competition angle lends itself really well to Diablo games. - John Hight</blue>
Travis Day: We’re discussing and looking into it, but I can’t promise that we’ll ever have one.
 
  
<font color="#FFFFFF">Ladder seasons some day?</font><br>
 
Travis: Everyone keeps asking about this! It’s something we talk about. It’s possible someday. One of the things I want is for Diablo 3 to remain playable for the long term, even after we’re not working on new updates anymore. It’s like D2 where there was hardly anyone working on it long term. Like, 5 years from now we’ll probably not be releasing new content an patches for Diablo 3. We’ll have moved on to working on Diablo4 or whatever.
 
  
Ladders work very well for that. They keep the game fresh and reset the economy for people who want to opt into it. That’s great, but it does come with some baggage. But we probably want to have that one day, but I don’t know when we’ll do it or how it’ll work.</blue>
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==History of Ladders in Diablo 3==
  
 +
Ladders were one of the first things fans asked for when Diablo 3 was first announced and it's always been Blizzard's desire to include such a thing, although they have run hot and cold on the subject in some of their responses over the years.
  
  
==Season Wipes for the Ladders?==
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'''14 September 2013'''
  
Many players requested regular seasonal ladder wipes in Diablo 3, and Blizzard's replies were ambivalent on that issue.[http://www.diablowiki.net/Gameplay_Panel_Blizzcon_2010]
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[[Travis Day]] speaking on [[Paragon]] experience being reset with new seasons, <ref>[http://diablo.incgamers.com/blog/comments/travis-day-on-paragon-2-0-and-ladders Resetting Paragon points] - Travis Day, Blizzard Entertainment, 14/09/2013</ref>
  
::''will there be ladder resets for the rankings on PvP?—Scyberdragon
 
::Hrm, there’s no intent for design on something like what. Why do you think it would be useful?—Diablo
 
  
::''without resets, new players would have a hard time getting up in the ranks as people who have been playing for years.—ScyberDragon
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<blue>Travis Day
::Since it’s a personal progression system it’s not likely to be something where you’re looking at a leaderboard a whole lot.—Diablo
 
  
::''after a certain amount of time (a couple of months-years) the ladder would probably rarely change as far as the top rankers.—Scyberdragon
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Paragon experience will be account but will also be broken out by game play mode. Players who play in Hardcore will have a separate hardcore paragon level from their non hardcore characters.
::Potentially, but it isn’t really a competition in that way. I’ll concede a *shrug* though as most of it is in early design.—Diablo
 
  
::''Well, are matches paired by ranking? New players (lower ranked) will never get to play older players (higher rank)—Scyberdragon
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When a season ends all of the paragon experience you have earned will be rolled into the appropriate pool of paragon experience for the account and you will be able to start at 0 again in the new season.
::Matches are paired by skill, which isn’t the same as personal progression.—Diablo
 
  
::''well, how is skill quantified/paired then? I assumed you got #up rank based on how well you did therefore rank representing skill.—Scyberdragon
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This is all still a work in progress and subject to change but that is what we are currently intending.</blue>
::Skill is quantified by your performance (win/lose) versus others. Your rank/personal progression always moves up. Think MW2.—Diablo
 
  
::''then what is the rank for?—ScyberDragon
 
::A way for you to see your progress, compare against friends, and a way for us to (potentially) give some vanity rewards away.—Diablo
 
  
Obviously from those comments, the developers didn't think the emphasis of PvP would be on overall rankings.  As the PvP system was overhauled and then delayed in D3C, it's unknown how much progress was made on any sort of ladders or character scores.
 
  
  
==Diablo II Ladders==
 
  
In Diablo II there are ladders that rank characters by experience. These are sorted by character class, Hardcore and Softcore characters, and by realm. There have been numerous [[ladder seasons]] since Diablo II was released, and since D2X these ladder resets have been used to reset the player population and economy, since [[ladder characters]] must be created anew in each ladder season, and can only interact with other ladder characters.
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'''13 June 2013'''
 +
 
 +
Blizzard community manager asks for input from gamers on what they would like to see in a ladder system in Diablo 3. <ref>[http://diablo.incgamers.com/blog/comments/blizzard-considering-diablo-3-ladders Player input on ladders] - Community manager, Blizzard Entertainment, 13/06/2014</ref>
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 +
<blue>Lylirra
 +
 
 +
 
 +
*How would you ideally like that system to work?
 +
*How long would you like the resets to be?
 +
*How many characters do you think players should be able to create for ladders? (Do you think they should take up the existing slots you have?)
 +
*Should there be an auction house for ladder characters?
 +
*Should there be any special items or perks for ladder-only characters? If so, what kind?
 +
*What kind of restrictions, if any, should be placed on ladder characters?
 +
*Do think players should be able to bring their ladder characters into “non-ladder” once a reset is complete?
 +
*Is it necessary for ladders to be competitive, or is it enough for players to just see for themselves how far they can go on their own?
 +
*Why would ladders improve your in-game experience?</blue>
 +
 
 +
 
 +
'''15 May 2013'''
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 +
[[Wyatt Cheng]] in a video stream back in May of 2013 addresses the issue of how a ladder resets the [[economy]]. <ref>[http://en.twitch.tv/archonthewizard/b/403862132  Economy reset] - Wyatt Cheng, Blizzard Entertainment, 15/05/2013</ref>
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 +
 
 +
<blue>Whyatt Cheng
 +
 
 +
 
 +
There are two aspect of ladder, both of which I think are interesting. One is the competitive ladder aspect, the race to the top. The other is the economy reset, this fresh sharded off economy where everyone begins clean. ...(snip)... So I think one of the benefits of a ladder is just this idea that it's really fun to start fresh, and experience this rapid rate of upgrading, again. A ladder is a great excuse to do it. Sometimes we all want to do it and we can choose to do it, but sometimes it's nice to do it together, as a global community. Or have a recognized badge of honor, for having done it.</blue>
 +
 
 +
 
 +
And later what excites him about ladders and how it could not happen until and [[expansion]].
 +
 
 +
 
 +
<blue>We're definitely looking into the possibility of a ladder, or something like that. I personally -- this is just me speaking and there are other people on the team who would disagree with me, so I'll say that, it's just my opinion -- I'm more excited about the reroll and clean economy aspect of ladder seasons, than I am of the race. I know the race is exciting too, and there's pictures of people who are getting ready for the new season. They have all their caffeinated drinks on their desk, and I think that's epic and awesome, if not always healthy. But realistically, yeah it's something we're cool with. It wouldn't be viable until an expansion.</blue>
 +
 
 +
 
 +
[[Travis Day]] also chimed in with enthusiasm but still, stresses the fact they will happen later rather than sooner.
 +
 
 +
 
 +
<blue>Travis Day
 +
 
 +
Ladder is something that is not out of the question. We talk about it, we're investigating it, you might see it one day. Not making any promises on when or how, but it is certainly something that we talk about a lot. A lot of the talk we do, or sometimes do, is like -- Diablo needs to live on well beyond the point of which we're working on the game. D2 had some support, but you're not going to see (and I'm pulling time frames out of butt, but): Five years from now, you're probably not going to see us making huge content patches, or class updates. At some point we'll set the game aside, sort of leave it as a work that we've completed, and move on to like Diablo 4, or whatever, right? Ladders is absolutely one of the things that helps the game stay fresh for people 5 years from now, or 3 years, or 2 years, or whatever. Ladders are cool, ladders comes with a lot of baggage when I say "ladders"; but the idea is of sort of a fresh economy and a fresh system for people who choose so, to opt into leveling all over again with a clean slate, with other people who want the same thing. That's really important and it's really compelling, and we probably want to have that one day, but I don't know how we'll implement it, or what it'll look like, or when it'll go in.</blue>
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 +
 
 +
 
 +
 
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'''September 2010'''
 +
 
 +
 
 +
A community manager pours a bit of cold water on the idea. <ref>[http://diablo.incgamers.com/blog/comments/more-on-d3s-end-game-and-achievements Achievements better than ladders] - Blizzard Community Manager, 23/09/2010</ref>
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 +
<blue>Bashiok (community manager)
 +
 
 +
 
 +
As far as the e-peen meter goes for showing off a higher level character, we think a proper achievement system is much better at this. There’s more variety, they’re more interesting and compelling for people to work toward. One important point of note is that our achievements are cross-character, meaning we can give achievements for things like leveling 5, 10… hell, 20 characters to 60. Certainly a bigger feat than a level 99, and we can give tangible rewards for it too.</blue>
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 +
 
 +
 
 +
 
 +
 
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=References=
 +
 
 +
<font size="-3">
 +
<references/>
 +
</font>
  
Many players would like to see expanded ladders in Diablo III, with more stats tracked and ranked, along with ladders measuring PvP prowess, as well as guilds, and more. Those sorts of features get added very late in the development cycle, or even after release, so it's unlikely that we'll learn more about ladders for some time, yet.
 
  
  
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[[category:battle.net]]
 
[[category:battle.net]]
[[category:rankings]]
 
 
[[category:arena]]
 
[[category:arena]]
 
[[category:reference]]
 
[[category:reference]]
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__NOTOC__

Revision as of 19:49, 27 April 2014

Ladders rank the position of players based on set metrics such as kill score and/or character level and they usually run for a period of time (season) after which time the ladder is reset.

Ladders and seasons have been confirmed by Blizzard to be coming to Reaper of Souls. [1]

... we’re still working on them, but the general gist is that you’ll be able to level up a character, we will have specific ladders for seasons, and also some goodies that will drop along the way. There’s more information of that to come, and we’re not making an announcement of when, but for sure Seasons are coming to Reaper of Souls. Yeah, the secret is out.


Details So Far Confirmed

In an interview in April 2014 John Hight fleshed out more of the details of how Ladders and Seasons were shaping up during development. [2]


  • Each Season begins with a fresh characters
  • No access to existing stash, loot or shards
  • When season ends all experience, items, gold etc is rolled back into your normal non-ladder roster
  • New, powerful legendaries that drop only to ladder characters
  • Leaderboards will rank progress by various metrics such as region, clans


Seasons are a shard of the existing game where everything is a fresh start. You start with a brand new character without access to any of the gold or items you collected with your primary account for the length of the season. We plan on creating brand new, powerful legendaries that only drop within in the season. After the season ends, all of your progress — your experience, your items, your gold, etc. — will be rolled into the main roster. The goal is the fresh-start feeling — so many changes and tweaks have happened since the launch of Diablo III — it is really energizing and fun to recreate that ‘first-moment-in-a-new-game’ feeling. We’ve also added leaderboards. Players can race on a variety of metrics to try to become the leader in their region or the top of their friends and clan lists. That friendly competition angle lends itself really well to Diablo games. - John Hight


History of Ladders in Diablo 3

Ladders were one of the first things fans asked for when Diablo 3 was first announced and it's always been Blizzard's desire to include such a thing, although they have run hot and cold on the subject in some of their responses over the years.


14 September 2013

Travis Day speaking on Paragon experience being reset with new seasons, [3]


Travis Day

Paragon experience will be account but will also be broken out by game play mode. Players who play in Hardcore will have a separate hardcore paragon level from their non hardcore characters.

When a season ends all of the paragon experience you have earned will be rolled into the appropriate pool of paragon experience for the account and you will be able to start at 0 again in the new season.

This is all still a work in progress and subject to change but that is what we are currently intending.



13 June 2013

Blizzard community manager asks for input from gamers on what they would like to see in a ladder system in Diablo 3. [4]

Lylirra


  • How would you ideally like that system to work?
  • How long would you like the resets to be?
  • How many characters do you think players should be able to create for ladders? (Do you think they should take up the existing slots you have?)
  • Should there be an auction house for ladder characters?
  • Should there be any special items or perks for ladder-only characters? If so, what kind?
  • What kind of restrictions, if any, should be placed on ladder characters?
  • Do think players should be able to bring their ladder characters into “non-ladder” once a reset is complete?
  • Is it necessary for ladders to be competitive, or is it enough for players to just see for themselves how far they can go on their own?
  • Why would ladders improve your in-game experience?


15 May 2013

Wyatt Cheng in a video stream back in May of 2013 addresses the issue of how a ladder resets the economy. [5]


Whyatt Cheng


There are two aspect of ladder, both of which I think are interesting. One is the competitive ladder aspect, the race to the top. The other is the economy reset, this fresh sharded off economy where everyone begins clean. ...(snip)... So I think one of the benefits of a ladder is just this idea that it's really fun to start fresh, and experience this rapid rate of upgrading, again. A ladder is a great excuse to do it. Sometimes we all want to do it and we can choose to do it, but sometimes it's nice to do it together, as a global community. Or have a recognized badge of honor, for having done it.


And later what excites him about ladders and how it could not happen until and expansion.


We're definitely looking into the possibility of a ladder, or something like that. I personally -- this is just me speaking and there are other people on the team who would disagree with me, so I'll say that, it's just my opinion -- I'm more excited about the reroll and clean economy aspect of ladder seasons, than I am of the race. I know the race is exciting too, and there's pictures of people who are getting ready for the new season. They have all their caffeinated drinks on their desk, and I think that's epic and awesome, if not always healthy. But realistically, yeah it's something we're cool with. It wouldn't be viable until an expansion.


Travis Day also chimed in with enthusiasm but still, stresses the fact they will happen later rather than sooner.


Travis Day Ladder is something that is not out of the question. We talk about it, we're investigating it, you might see it one day. Not making any promises on when or how, but it is certainly something that we talk about a lot. A lot of the talk we do, or sometimes do, is like -- Diablo needs to live on well beyond the point of which we're working on the game. D2 had some support, but you're not going to see (and I'm pulling time frames out of butt, but): Five years from now, you're probably not going to see us making huge content patches, or class updates. At some point we'll set the game aside, sort of leave it as a work that we've completed, and move on to like Diablo 4, or whatever, right? Ladders is absolutely one of the things that helps the game stay fresh for people 5 years from now, or 3 years, or 2 years, or whatever. Ladders are cool, ladders comes with a lot of baggage when I say "ladders"; but the idea is of sort of a fresh economy and a fresh system for people who choose so, to opt into leveling all over again with a clean slate, with other people who want the same thing. That's really important and it's really compelling, and we probably want to have that one day, but I don't know how we'll implement it, or what it'll look like, or when it'll go in.



September 2010


A community manager pours a bit of cold water on the idea. [6]

Bashiok (community manager)


As far as the e-peen meter goes for showing off a higher level character, we think a proper achievement system is much better at this. There’s more variety, they’re more interesting and compelling for people to work toward. One important point of note is that our achievements are cross-character, meaning we can give achievements for things like leveling 5, 10… hell, 20 characters to 60. Certainly a bigger feat than a level 99, and we can give tangible rewards for it too.



References

  1. Ladders coming to Diablo 3 - Josh Mosqueira, Blizzard Entertainment, 25/04/2014
  2. Details of Seasons Shacknews interview with John Hight, 24/04/2014
  3. Resetting Paragon points - Travis Day, Blizzard Entertainment, 14/09/2013
  4. Player input on ladders - Community manager, Blizzard Entertainment, 13/06/2014
  5. Economy reset - Wyatt Cheng, Blizzard Entertainment, 15/05/2013
  6. Achievements better than ladders - Blizzard Community Manager, 23/09/2010